Tony McManus Interview

by Rick Landers.

Although Tony McManus clearly has a reputation as a leading Celtic guitarist, the ancient roots of the music itself are somewhat nebulous. Strains can be found originating in Ireland and Scotland, as well as other unexpected places such as Portugal. Whatever the origins, the music found its way to America and infiltrated the melodic intentions of Appalachian musicians, as well as gained popularity around the world.

Irish born McManus delights in the sparkling guitar tunings of the genre, while his league of world-wide fans grows with each new album. He taught himself guitar at an early age and after ending his academic pursuits he could be found as a session guitarist in Glasgow and Edinburgh.

In 1996, Tony released his self-titled debut album on the Greentrax Recordings label. Next up was his Pourquoi Quebec that drew international attention. His reputation began to soar when Nashville’s Compass Records issued his Ceol More CD that featured arrangements of Charles Mingus’s jazz classic “Goodbye Pork Pie Hat” and others including a revision of a 17th century Jewish Hymm called, “Shalom Aleichem.”

In 2002, McManus won twin “Musician of the Year” awards by the BBC Folks Awards and The Scottish Traditional Music Awards. Around the same time, Ceol More gathered attention by being featured on the "Critic’s Album of the Year" list in Acoustic Guitar magazine, as well as being named“Live Ireland Awards' "Album of the Year."

Listen to clips from albums by Tony McManus:

In 2009, Tony became a Gold Medal winner when he won Acoustic Guitar magazine's reader's poll in the Celtic category. Other Gold Medal winners included Tommy Emmanuel, Doc Watson, John Jorgenson, John Williams, Paco de Lucía, and Tony Rice.

His collaborative work can be heard on over 60 albums and he has worked with such fine performers as John Jorgenson, Men of Steel, the Nashville Chamber Orchestra, Jean Michel, Seikou Keita, Andy Irvine and others. He’s performed on stages in Germany, Australia, England, France, Italy, Japan and is a regularly featured artist at the Chet Atkins Festival in Nashville, Tennessee. One of his most recent performances, the “All Star Guitar Night” at Ryman Auditorium in Nashville displayed his talents alongside Steve Morse, Bela Fleck, Victor Wooton, Muriel Anderson, Bryan Sutton and Les Paul.

Modern Guitars met Tony at a house party hosted by guitar builder Paul Reed Smith. We found him upstairs hanging out with Grammy award winning bluegrass player Ricky Skaggs. Earlier that evening, Tony, Ricky and fellow guitarist Cody Kilby gifted the crowd with some virtuoso instrumentals, including a sweet version of Harry Chapin’s “Cats in the Cradle.” While Ricky played some mandolin, Kentucky Thunder’s Kilby and Scottish-born McManus opened up with some mind boggling licks spiced with some of Tony’s open-tuned Gaelic acoustic runs.

Rick Landers: When we met you were playing an acoustic set with Ricky Skaggs and another fine guitarist named Cody Kilby. You seemed pretty impressed with those guys, but then you joined in and the crowd were “wowed” by your open tuned Gaelic style licks. Had you played with Ricky and Cody before?

Tony McManus: I first met Ricky at the Edmonton Folk Festival in 2004. He was already aware of my music though I’m not sure how. We'd shared a side stage during one afternoon, both playing solo. Also on stage were Davy Spillane on uilleann pipes, Kevin Glackin on fiddle and the great bluegrass band Blue Highway. There could have been a monster jam at the end of that session.

That evening Ricky’s band Kentucky Thunder was on the main stage and was incredible. The musician who blew me away was Cody Kilby. I told some of my U.S. musician friends about the experience and got knowing looks of awe. He was well known as a prodigy at festivals such as Winfield in Kansas where he'd won some fierce contests. I finally got to meet Cody at Paul Reed Smith’s home just before we performed!

Rick: A lot of guitarists start out on rock ‘n’ roll, before venturing into jazz, blues, classical and other styles of music. How did your interests evolve and was there a particular moment that influenced you to find your Gaelic style?

Tony: I grew up with Irish music on the record player from day one and so got exposed to what’s been called the “ballad boom" with groups like the Dubliners and the Clancy Brothers that emerged around the same time as the folk boom in the States. The Clancys in particular had huge success over the pond. It filtered back to Ireland and eventually Scotland too.

In the mid-seventies when I started playing music there was an explosion of interest in traditional instrumental music that previously had been the preserve of old men playing for each other in the pub. This was the stuff that really fired my imagination and got me on the path I’m still on, I guess. Suddenly, thanks to groups like the Chieftains and Planxty, this music became hip.

At the same time my older brother was working in a record store and was bringing home all sorts of stuff from the late seventies, so from prog rock to Talking Heads and everything in between. So I guess, thanks to him, my tastes in rock were a bit precocious. I saw Zappa live when I was 13, Peter Gabriel’s first solo tour when I was 12. But, I never got an electric guitar. So, musically my focus was playing the traditional music I still loved. I learned by ear some stuff by Steve Howe and that genre, but never really developed it into anything personal

Rick: What tunings are most associated with Gaelic traditional music and do you venture beyond those in your own compositions?

Tony: Well, Davy Graham, who died away only a few weeks ago, came up with a tiny modification to open D tuning [DADF#AD]. With this tuning the big fat major third in the middle tells too much of a story. Celtic music often lives in the space between major and minor.

Davy had the insight to take that F# up to G, so now you have a nice ambiguous fourth in the tuning and major and minor are equally accessible. DADGAD was born! It became a bit of a cliché however. It’s very forgiving so lots of people came to it as a substitute for really learning the instrument. You’d find in sessions one or more players tipping away on the same handful of chords, not really knowing what was going on and it all began to sound the same. I think that bubble has deflated if not burst and players are getting more adventurous in this and other tunings.

At the other extreme, Pierre Bensusan took DADGAD tuning and decided to explore it in the same depth that, say, a jazz guitarist would explore standard tuning. It really is a powerful tool in the right hands.

The Scottish singer Dick Gaughan came up with a tuning for playing bagpipe stuff on guitar which was a modification of the tuning Martin Carthy was using. Dick came up with EAAEAE. It even sounds like a drone to say it! I decided to take the low E down to D and these days Dick does the same. So, the tuning is DAAEAE.

I pinched a couple of tunings from Martin Simpson CGCGCD [C add9] and CGDGCD [Gsus4].
Those plus standard and dropped D are the ones I regularly use.

Rick: Some of your quieter tunes have a soft explosion feel to them, that seem to allow chords and even single notes to blossom outward, if you know what I mean. Would you agree with that description and, if so, what moods are you seeking to create? Maybe this is a stupid question.

Tony: Not a stupid question at all. I often try in the slower stuff to have some layers going on. The bass lines anchor the tune and then there are often spread chords or arpeggios and I hope to get the melody to float on top of that.

On the new CD for example there are a few places where the melody note is played as a harmonic at the 12th and having hit the note there it can sustain while I play a chord underneath somewhere else on the neck. I can create some nice dissonance that way.

I naturally tend to exploit the dynamics of the instrument in my playing. I think you are referring to the lullaby I played at Paul Reed Smith’s house. In that arrangement I’m playing a simple melody on top and filling in the chords much more quietly, so the melody “blossoms”- good word!

The acoustic guitar is capable of speaking in so many different voices and moods, articulated just by going at the string in a different way. Sometimes I’ll use the soft part of the right hand thumb to get a softer bass sound other times I use the nail of the same finger like a flatpick. It’s all about articulation.

Rick: If Modern Guitars readers want to get better versed in Gaelic music, what other musicians would you recommend they check out? Are there any landmark albums that come to mind?

Tony: Well, Gaelic usually refers to the language of the highland Scots- having grown up in the industrial belt near Glasgow, I don’t actually speak it!

If you mean Celtic music then there’s a lifetime of exploration possible. The Celts were a tribe of Europeans, possibly originally Asians who ended up occupying the western extremities of Europe; the Highlands of Scotland, the west of Ireland, Brittany in France, Galica in Spain, Cornwall in England, Wales, Isle of Man etc. All of these have differing traditions and some died out and are really the subject of musical paleontology.

In Irish music I’d listen to The Bothy Band. A six piece from the '70s who played dance music with incredible power and precision. Liam O’Flynn- the most elegant exponent of the Uilleann pipes; Altan from Donegal; Lúnasa, and others. There are also some great Irish-American music out there; Liz Carroll, the band Solas, Eileen Ivers. My favourite singer is Iarla O’Lionaird who records for Gabriel’s Real World label.

As far as Scottish music, my favorite bands would be Ossian, Silly Wizard and more up to date there’s Shooglenifty. The fiddler Alasdair Fraser has been making great music for years except for a spell in 1999 when he made an album with me! Martyn Bennett did some incredible stuff with trad music, samples and dance beats. Piper Gordon Duncan did some incredible things over all too short a career. Composer Billy Jackson has written some great pieces based on traditional forms for chamber ensembles.

In Brittany, the bands Kornog, Den, Gwerz, Barzaz. Mostly comprise permutations of the same individuals, but all are good. Anything involving fiddler Jacky Molard or his piper brother Patrick will be worth listening to.

For Galicia, the star is Carlos Nunez, also Xose Manuel Budino, and Mercedez Peon.

Rick: A lot of American traditional folk music derives from the British Isles. Have you ever been surprised to hear an American folk tune that duplicated some original Scottish song?

Tony: Very true. The music of the Appalachians is heavily influenced by Scottish music. I remember meeting old time fiddler Bruce Molsky for the first time and he played a very crooked tune [odd numbers of beats in a bar] from West Virginia called “Flowers of Edinburg” which he assumed was name for the small town of Edinburg, West Virginia. I played him the well known Scottish reel “The Flowers of Edinburgh” and the look on his face was priceless. It was an ironed out version of the tune he’d played for years.There are lots of examples.

Rick: A lot of us are always interested in the types of guitars, especially, those of smaller builders that artists find appealing. What’s hanging on your wall at home?

Tony: I am very lucky to have a bunch of really great guitars and I tend to hang onto them so they accumulate. My first really good guitar was a 12 fret 000 size from Scottish builder Bill Kelday. He also made me a baritone in 1996 and then at the opposite end of the scale a tiny terz guitar for my 40th birthday.

Roger Bucknall at Fylde made me a great Cedar and Walnut guitar. Must get that one out again. My main touring machine for the past seven years has been a Melville OM from Brisbane, Australia. I've got two of those, one in Cocobolo and one in Brazilian. Seriously good guitars.

I have two PRS acoustics. One very plain prototype that sounds like a cannon and another encrusted with bling that sounds like a cannon. Very consistent is Mr. Smith. I love to flatpick on a dreadnought that John Slobod at Circa Guitars made me. It’s a retro herringbone D28. He's a builder to watch.

I’ve a little guitar from Davy Stuart in New Zealand that lives in Nashville tuning. I have a beautiful Cocobolo OM that Marc Beneteau in St. Thomas Ontario made me. His stuff is really great.

I’ve a Larrivee 12-string that I’ve only had for four years , so it’s not tuned yet.

Rich Mermer in Florida made a beautiful nylon string that I have- and another from Avalon Guitars in Ireland (some former employees of Lowden Guitars set up that company). I have a sitar guitar from Linda Manzer. I played it in her house and we both went “wow!” It takes a really gentle touch to play that guitar and I just bonded with it.

Rick: From what I can tell it looks like you prefer German spruce tops and Brazilian rosewood sides and backs and maple, kind of punchier woods, than say mahogany, that I personally find a bit muddy. What type of tonal qualities are you looking for when you buy or have a guitar built?

Tony: I guess the key words are balance and clarity. I like a powerful low end but not one that drowns out the rest of the sound. Separation of tones is very important too. I don’t want chords to just form a wall of sound. I like each string to sound and be heard clearly.

Rick: How about electric guitar? You ever plug in and let her rip?

Tony: I had a mad brain fart one day a few years ago and bought a Strat. I’ve used it in on a couple of projects. I have no keyboard skills so I’ve used the Strat with a long delay and a volume pedal to create pads in the studio. Once at a concert in Glasgow Cathedral when I picked it up the audience audibly gasped! They let me off though. I got a PRS electric, courtesy of Paul and David Grissom, just a short while ago. I guess now I have to educate myself and go out and buy an amp.

Rick: Are you a multi-instrumentalist or vocalist?

Tony: I used to think I could play mandolin until I started spending time in the States and hearing the likes of Don Steinberg and John Reichmann and the late Butch Baldassari. Let's say I dabble. I’d love to be able to play fiddle- my first instrument! I have been known to sing on occasion not on record though. Actually I’ve done some backing vocals on a couple of things.The thing I love is that the guitar is so versatile that you can be just a guitarist and also a multi instrumentalist; acoustic, electric, six, twelve, nylon, steel, pedal steel….

Rick: Most of us, when we think of Scotland, immediately think of the Highland pipers. Have you ever worked with pipers on any of your tunes?

Tony: I’ve been lucky to work with pipers like Fred Morrison and the late Gordon Duncan whose last album I produced. Both of these musicians push the boundaries with their work. Gordon’s album for example contains a five minute piece called "Thunderstruck" based on the AC-DC song.

On the last, but one solo CD Ceol More I used a loop of a pipe band tuning up at the world championships in Glasgow. There were, once we’d layered it, several hundred chanters buzzing away and this colossal drone over which I played bagpipe tunes! What a great instrument.Glad I don’t play it though.

Rick: During the ‘60s, there was the British Invasion of music into America. More recently, we’ve been experiencing an Indie global invasion with the Internet. Do you foresee any future possibilities where some musical force will become a new invasion?

Tony: Don’t know. I’m much better at predicting the past! Music in general has become so global that the danger is some sort of stylistic homogeneity where ethnic music gets swamped in a drive for commercial success. This is not an argument for purity. I generally find that the most successful experimenters have a secure handle on the raw tradition and those who are joyriding are easy to spot. I don’t know if this answers your question. If not, maybe write a question it does answer!

Rick: We’ve been intrigued by the music of the African country, Mali, and wonder if the music of that culture or from the Continent will infiltrate other music, even to the extent of fusing with Gaelic in some fashion.

Tony: Well, the Afro-Celt Sound System has been around for a good few years now fusing African and Irish elements. My experience of music from Mali is limited to Salif Keita whose album Soro has been a favorite for years.I toured a few years ago in England with a great kora player from Senegal called Sekou Keita and loved playing with him and would love to do more!

Rick: Tony, you played in some very intimate settings as well a large gatherings, like the Chet Atkins Festival in Nashville, The Bogota International Guitar Festival and others around the world. Do you prefer the smaller gigs where you can have a conversation with the audience or are you just as comfortable reaching out when there are a thousand or more in a sea of people?

Tony: Each has its place. Chetfest in Nashville was scary the first time just because of the status of the festival and the level of musicianship involved. But, I was made so welcome by so many people and have made a ton of friends through doing that gig I wouldn’t miss it.

Bogota was scary because I had to follow one of the world’s greatest virtuosos, I was in a new continent, jetlagged and I’d never had an interpreter on stage with me before. It was fine though, the size of the audience really shouldn’t matter. Once you get inside the music the instrument should become invisible and it’s all about communication and expression.

Rick: You were a guest artist at the “All Star Guitar Night,” in Nashville with Steve Morse, Muriel Anderson, Bela Fleck and a favorite American “son,” the great Les Paul. Did you get a chance to play with Les or to talk to him? What was that like? Sorry, we’re pretty enamored with Les.

Tony: That was a night to remember. A few months before the All Star gig I was at an award ceremony in London and shared a table with Robert Noakes, a great Scottish singer-guitarist and then at BBC Radio. I mentioned the Les Paul gig and he asked if I fancied getting an interview. So, for one half hour I became a journalist. He was fabulous! In mid-answer to the first question Steve Morse began to sound check on stage, with predictable consequences.

Les said how much he loved Steve’s music waited patiently for quiet and continued the interview now with his minder guarding the door to stop further intrusion. He spoke very eloquently and passionately about the things that had driven him, such as his love of the guitar, his insatiable curiosity about electronics, his commitment to keep gigging as long as possible.

I remember winding up the interview by asking if the electric pioneer had any advice for an acoustic player like me. He said, exact words, “Tony, here’s the thing. There’s room for everybody on the bus! Whether you play the electric guitar, the Spanish guitar or the acoustical guitar there’s room for everybody on the bus. But, I’ll tell you this, there’s no one gonna play louder than Les Paul!”

Rick: You’ve been a session guitarist for over 60 albums. How would a young guitarist, with talent, get into session work, and is it more lucrative from an income perspective or more to build and maintain a music network?

Tony: I’m looking for advice on that! I did a lot more in Scotland, than I've done since moving to Canada. I guess because Scotland is so small it’s easy enough to get to any studio in the country. In Canada the Celtic music in mostly on the East Coast and a three hour flight away from me! A lot of my studio work has been pretty genre specific. I don’t do that many mainstream sessions. I’m fortunate to be asked to be myself in the sense that I’m called on to make my own voice heard. So I guess the best way to get established is to be versatile yet distinctive and dependable.

Rick: Not to put you on the spot, but I guess I will…What did you think of the new PRS acoustic that you test drove last summer?

Tony: I love it. I’d had that guitar for a year when I was at Paul’s place. Ricky Skaggs suggested me to Paul Reed Smith as someone worth checking out as a test pilot for the acoustics and I’m very flattered that he did so. It’s a new situation for me to be dealing with a large company, but what strikes me about Paul is not so much the level of success he’s achieved or the size of the operation, but the intensity of his passion for building better guitars. In that respect he is the same as Linda Manzer or John Slobod or any of the solo luthiers I deal with who make a dozen guitars a year. It’s all about passion.

A lot of effort has gone into these guitars. Paul has a friend in L.A. with a collection of very valuable Torres and Ramirez guitars and they were examined in great detail to see how, for example, Segovia could play concert halls on such an instrument unamplified. They were launched at NAMM and it was very exciting for me to be involved in the event. It made its TV and Radio debut the same month in Scotland and I love playing it. They are very versatile in that they are great for both flatpicking and fingerstyle and the pickup system PRS has developed is great.They can be played really loud without feedback.

Rick: One of my favorite guitarists, Richard Thompson, has moved between traditional music and modern pieces. Have you ever worked with him and how would you say your style differs from his? Any plans to collaborate on something with Richard?

Tony: The minute Richard makes the call I’m there! We met so fleetingly and on only one occasion that I doubt he’d remember, but it was at a festival in Marin County, California north of San Francisco about 10 years ago. His style is incredible, hybrid; pick and two fingers. He really plays the guitar like a band with percussion, rhythm, harmony and lead all going on at the same time as his amazing songs. I sometimes use that kind of pick and fingers approach having learned it watching the late American guitarist Isaac Guillory in folk clubs in the UK. But, Thomson has really taken it somewhere beyond. Like I say, if he would like to get together, I’m available.

Rick: Japan is filled with guitar fanatics and I understand that you toured there in 2008. Besides the audience receptions, did you get a chance to meet with fans one-on-one and did you find them to be well-informed about Gaelic music or at least enthusiastic to be informed?

Tony: I loved Japan! It was on my radar for years, but finally through Stefan Grossman I made contact with the guy who distributes my DVDs in Asia, Tokio Uchida. He is a wonderful guitarist who has learned a great deal from Stefan. In fact, his honeymoon was a trip to the US for a lesson. Tokio organized the tour and looked after everything.

I met some real devotees which was an incredibly flattering experience, being so far from anywhere I’d previously played and the autograph sessions at each gig were really warm and friendly. I found people to be really into the guitar in general and there were a few who were really into Celtic music. One person came up to the table in Yokohama with a CD for me to sign of an album I recorded with fiddler Maeve Donnelly in Ireland. I was amazed as Maeve’s album has no general distribution and the person had bought it in the one shop, Custy’s in Ennis, County Clare, Ireland where it’s available!

I had been warned about the need for great cultural sensitivity and the possibility of inadvertently offending against Japanese custom. Maybe the advice was out of date, but I found the people to be really easy going and very polite and friendly. I’ll be back in a heartbeat.

Rick: You had a relatively ambitious tour schedule with Japan, Canada, and the U.S. showing up on your calendar. I was wondering how you fill up gaps, studio work or vacation or what?

Tony: No, my website is just usually not up to date. There actually are very few gaps. But, with a young son at home I’m trying to do lots of short trips rather than the six and seven week tours I used to do.

Rick: What’s up next for you as far as recording or producing yourself or others?

Tony: I have an album of duets in the works. My plan is to have each track represent some area of music that inspires me or has been important to my development and work as a musician. That could be whole genres of music, such as bluegrass or geographical areas such as Brittany in France or concepts such as teaching.

So, I’ve picked a dream team of musicians who exemplify each of these things to me. Needless to say, they are all good friends who I’d pay to hang out with anyway. But, it’s a clever plan to spend some creative time with some musicians whom I love dearly.

Already in the can are tracks with Russ Barenberg, Martin Simpson and Gaelic singer Karen Matheson. I’ve plans to record with Breton flute player Jean Michel Veillon, old time American fiddler Bruce Molsky, Irish singer Iarla O’Lionaird, Scots singer Dick Gaughan and more. All people I’ve known for years, but never recorded with. I’m also going to record a duet with a long time student to explore the idea of the musician as teacher. Release is scheduled for 2019!

Rick: How’s your 2009 tour schedule been and what's it looking like through the year?

Tony: 2009 includes dates across Canada, New England with Maeve Donnelly, solo in Dallas, Tennessee, Oregon, England with Andy McKee and Johnny Dickinson, solo in Germany, Italy possibly Switzerland and Austria. I’d love to go back to Australia after a four year gap.

Related Link
Tony McManus
Experience Paul Reed Smith (XPRS) 2008

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